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Poster: safpsy Date: Oct 15, 2015 7:06pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: New format/layout

An archive is only useful if it is easy for people to find information and use that information. The new format/layout fails this basic test miserably. It is not intuitive, easy to use, or helpful. There does not seem to be an order to the entries and the titles without descriptors are virtually useless.

There is no way that this format was ever tested on lay audiences. I have shown it to three very intelligent, technologically savvy people and they could not understand the reasoning behind the new format.

If I am forced to use the new format I will no longer have the pleasure of scrolling through the different entries and trying shows that pique my interest. I will just stick with the shows I already know, because without understandable titles and descriptors I will not start randomly trying new entries.

This is such a shame. I am sure it is hard to admit that this new format is a failure. Especially when so many people put so much time and effort into it, but sometimes you just have to accept the reality of the situation. It is time to scrap the new format and put energy into making the old format better.

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Poster: Lum Edwards Date: Oct 16, 2015 5:45am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

i didnt like it much at first but you can tweak the sort by settings to make it easier to find things. i now prefer the new layout.

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Poster: BarrettRoad Date: Oct 21, 2015 10:04pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

For a few days when the title search worked I had hopes the new format may be almost as useable as the classic format. Now that the title search stopped working using it has turned into an exercise in futility.

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Poster: AncientAxim Date: Oct 22, 2015 12:09am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

I noticed I can't find things under titles- so THAT's what it is- its broken?

I also don't understand the new format, it is much harder for me to find things- its in this weird, "picture icon" format when my brain wants to look for text. Is this the new dumbing down of society in action? You know, like in "Idicocracy" when the guy went to the hospital, and the admissions clerk instead of using medical coding simply pushed a button that had a corresponding image? One icon had a guy holding his head in pain, another one had him holding his stomach, another icon had a guy shrugging with this hands up in the air to say "I don't know".

Is there any correlation to the new format and the huge influx of spam and posts from Pakistan people posting garbage? I noticed they both seemed to appear simultaneously. Perhaps this is our New World Order and we are just getting a peek at it, you know- a little hint as to what is in store for us all. Us "peons".

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Poster: BarrettRoad Date: Oct 22, 2015 4:48am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

It is only fair to tell you that after I struggled with it for at least a quarter hour the title search did start working. I am not sure if it was a case of accidentally stumbling onto the way to make it work or a case of intermittent operation of the new software, or what is in store for me next time I try using it.

I notice lot of "upgrades" of original versions that are less user friendly, more bandwidth and memory demanding, and less functional. I can't help but suspect their main purpose is for stroking the ego of those who cause them to exist.

A website devoted to appreciation of vintage radio programs is the last place I would expect to find this kind of thing.

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Poster: R Pal Date: Oct 22, 2015 6:04am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

There are ways to revive the old format. I hope they stay available but think the plan is to punish us into submission. If you do a search on "New Format" you will find several posts with methods to return to the old format. And there was talk of an independent sites creation of a useful mirror site.
Personally, I have stopped uploading my shows, downloaded all the shows I enjoy and am preparing for the eventual loss of this site. The treatment of the loyal user base by those who once accepted my cash donations and recordings has left me with a bad feeling. Now that the admins have said they do not need further donations I guess alienating OTR users is not an problem.
This looks like a sad end to a nice on-line community. If anyone has an alternative OTR venue I would be pleased to know of it. I still have numerous digitized tapes to put somewhere.

Radio Pal

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Poster: Jeff Kaplan Date: Oct 23, 2015 10:22am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

hi,
We are keenly aware of feedback from the OTR folks on archive.org. I'd like to encourage you to continue to upload to archive.org. While we continue to evolve the site I do understand the frustration some people have with the new site because using it is substantially different than the old site. But I have seen time and again that once users get the hang of how to use it they are very happy with the results and consider it an improvement. Much of the site is based on best practices from other large sites so it typically would not seem that alien to users of those sites. And, there will be features rolled out in the next yer that were not possible with the backend of the old site. I can say for certain that usage of the site in general has increased since the redesign. So, I'd encourage you to consider continuing to upload. We are listening and we certainly are not intentionally trying to alienate anyone. Donations are all well and good but we are motivated more by preserving and sharing materials. That is our mission. Thanks for indulging a somewhat longwinded post.

-jeff

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Poster: safpsy Date: Oct 24, 2015 9:44am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

One of the really basic things you could do to make the site more user friendly is make all the icons for the shows a uniform size. Now if I have three icons the same size and two larger the whole next row gets shifted so it is no longer easy to follow the alphabetized listing. It might look cool, but it really screws up trying to find something.

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Poster: Jeff Kaplan Date: Oct 27, 2015 11:17am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

not sure what you mean by "make all the icons for the shows a uniform size." if you're referring to how search results are displayed you can switch to "listview" to just have results in text form.

FAQ at https://archive.org/about/faqs.php#1238 might help.

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Poster: R Pal Date: Oct 27, 2015 12:56pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

Sadly this is not being done for us and there is no champion of OTR. Any regular OTR user would understand the uniform icon size request. But the few admin replies over the changes here are often disconnected with the actual site problems.
For instance there is still an argument in another section about if thumbnails show when and where you want to see them. The admins are not responsible for these changes and do not spend all day using the Archive either. Unless its GD land of course.

But I see the statistics shown at https://archive.org/about/stats.php indicate lost new users and fewer postings. This is not surprising as the site is not actually a forum site. What it is cannot be determined until the promised bigger changes occur next year.

Again I ask; Is there another forum for OTR folks? This one seems to be headed for a dip in New Coke.

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Poster: Jeff Kaplan Date: Oct 27, 2015 1:33pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

i offer to help and this is your response?

fwiw, sitewide usage is up substantially since the new site was launched and generally increases every month.

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Poster: R Pal Date: Oct 28, 2015 1:41am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

Please make the link to those statistics which show the Archive is being used by more OTR folks available here.

And I have tried to make it clear that no one blames the admins such as yourself for what is an unpleasant, un-requested change to a site that was functioning in a manor many users found easy to use and intuitive. But there are many examples of admin answers not actually clearing up the users questions about the new horror.
The different size icons is a good example. Just go to the OTR main page and you will see many different size descriptive icons floating up as you scroll down. To many of us the jumbled grouping is not useful and the list view you suggest has its own problems, such as font and color. The original real Internet Archive made things easily visible and well sized.

I will not rehash the others and just further annoy you. You have been patient and helpful for a long time and this may be getting to you.

Is there somewhere on this site that the features not yet rolled out can be examined? Do they include a forum section our any other community area?

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Poster: Jeff Kaplan Date: Oct 28, 2015 10:20am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout


i've attached an image of the oldtimeradio collection page. still not sure what you mean by "different size icons". please help me understand.

i'm not trying to be argumentative but i did say "sitewide" not OTR specifically.

you can go to https://indexer.archive.org/services/views/oldtimeradio and see that since the beta rollout in january that usage has generally been slightly increased compared to the prior 10 months. what has fallen is "items added".

Attachment: Screen_Shot_2015-10-28_at_10.20.02_AM.png

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Poster: R Pal Date: Oct 28, 2015 2:17pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout - Old Time Radio

Your attachment seems to be in the New Format list view for the radio section.? You have no idea how difficult the faded New Format is to see when a person has eye trouble. Try using it while squinting and from a few yards back, sonny. Where did the text go? Can't make out the title. That format is unworkable to many. The section is called "OLD" Time Radio.

Attached is a screen shot that may explain the line up problem. I tried to outline the blocks with blue. The small text floating pop ups, endless scroll and the other gee-gaws do not help when you cant make out which little black squigly thing is which. Black text on light blue background, limited descriptions, regular lined up icons and control over the scroll would be my preference. And maybe have the collections show at the top in similar sized icons and the single shows listed in more regular sized blocks. I am certain others have different requests. I will be glad when the person in charge makes user customizable screens available.

I will not detail the other problems such as loss of Forum, odd collection listings, those wiggly things and the general disorganized presentation of this thing right now.

Thanks for trying though.

Attachment: Archive_blocks.jpg

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Poster: Jeff Kaplan Date: Oct 28, 2015 3:01pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout - Old Time Radio

i'm neither going to defend nor criticize the changes, just help people use it the way it is.

the tile view is that way by design which is why i prefer list view. so, that "problem" is solved in that way.

Personally i do not see list view as any less readable than the old site. the descriptions are in black on white, links in blue but are a larger font. yes, there is some text in gray such as views and topics but not so light as to be much less viewable than black text.

and the forums are there obviously because you are using them.

so i suspect that like many others your criticism is more about change than usability. and i understand that. you knew the old site well and the new one has a learning curve for users of the old site. like i said, i'm neither going to defend nor criticize it. i will say that it is equally usable and does have some search options that were not available in the old version.

and, i am here to assist.

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Poster: AncientAxim Date: Oct 26, 2015 11:31pm
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

Quote" make all the icons for the shows a uniform size" Exactly! the new format is just bizarre. It looks like those stupid "Trending" word buzz things that float around on other websites that show what people are searching for. It's annoying, I really do NOT care what "other people" are "liking" or searching for, or clicking on. This is supposed to be an ARCHIVE site- not a "See What's Trending!" or, what it looks like to me, a huge investment by one of those um... large "NGO"s that give big bucks to non-profits, in exchange for "tweaking a few things". I noticed like I said before- that we've gotten a LOT of pakistani spam, junk crap and lots and lots of "trans" forums (why?? They make up less than one quarter of 2 percent of the population?? Why should they get their own forum and area?)

bizarre. And I know very well where "archive.org" is going, now that they got their pay off.

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Poster: Audio And Visual Club Date: Oct 22, 2015 7:47am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

I so agree, it's so hard to find the sections I want, before One heading with sub headings, this new mess of a format has all categories on one page, i spend forever, trying to find the ones i want, scrolling up and down, to me, it looks like someone took this entire site and blew it up, the new is ugly, and just a complete mess. WHY in this day and age do people feel the need to change for change sakes

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Poster: Noah 8-? Date: Nov 6, 2015 7:57am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: New format/layout

Audio and visual Club?

What's that?

Noah 8-?